ChinaDialogue: Latest responses to “The rich consume and the poor suffer the pollution”

[TRANSLATED] Originally, the environment was well governed under the socialist government.

Sun, 25 Oct 2009 07:51:23 +0000

Originally, the environment was well governed under the socialist government. Today, we finally know, having taken us a long time to recognise …… that we are ignorant and have seen and heard little of the world. Thank you. Mr. Pan Yue. This comment was translated by Laura Bewley

[TRANSLATED] Think about where our responsibilities lie

Sun, 12 Jul 2009 17:32:25 +0000

While I agree with certain parts of the article, there are some areas I'd like to take issue with. For a start, I think it draws an unnecessary comparison between socialism and environmentalism: the former is an idealistic philosophy and thus something which cannot reasonably be executed to the letter in real life. Mr. Pan's evocation of socialist equality as a means of encouraging the spread of a unified environmental movement is simply a fantasy. Environmental awareness is unrelated to political systems - gathering everyone up into one big unified mass isn't a prerequisite to protecting the natural world. Then there's the issue of environmentalism's Western roots - this isn't necessarily a poor reflection on China. If we'd had a hundred year head-start on our development, you can bet your bottom dollar we'd be up there with the leading environmentalist nations. Also, I don't think there's a need to start blaming capitalism outright, even if it's certainly a factor we need to take into account. It doesn't matter whether you're operating in a capitalist, socialist, or any other system, people's main concerns are still going to basic economic ones like getting a roof over your head or food in your belly. I agree with an earlier poster on another point - businesses should have the right to decide where they take their production. It's not a crime for people to want to improve their quality of life, so one can see why some areas are happy to accept the arrival of production industries. In this respect, there is a dual responsibility where pollution is concerned - in addition to the industries themselves, developing countries keen to net a vital source of income need to be aware of the potential consequences for pollution their actions may have. Producing countries need to impose conditions binding corporations to accept responsibility for pollution. Without such precautions, they end up realizing too late that "those evil corporations have polluted our environment," and can do nothing except vainly point the finger of blame. I also think that (at least on the surface) capitalism hasn't necessarily started blaming other people after desecrating their environments for them. I've read a lot of environmentalist literature, and much of it deals with the issue of the kind of environmental damage that has taken place in developing countries. However, it always takes care to explain that this situation is hard for such countries to avoid, while emphasising that more developed countries must shoulder a larger part of the responsibility because they use a greater proportion of resources. These kinds of opinions and attitudes are also mirrored by both professors and course books in environmental science courses. This is perhaps a consequence of the different approach to education in the West, where students are encouraged to approach problems from the various opposing perspectives before deciding where their own responsibilities lie. So, there's no need to keep trumpeting the wonders of socialism - are we environmentalists here or missionaries? I think there are two ways out for Chinese environmentalists today - educating the next generation and controlling population. I'm not sure all these large-scale environmental improvement programmes are going to get us all that far - as many critics have agreed, although they may do a bit of short-term cleaning up, they're fundamentally ill-equipped to deal with the problem of continued pollution. But if we're going to educate people, we need to do so from a scientific and environmentalist starting point, encouraging individuals to make their own contributions by eating less meat or buying fewer consumer goods.

[TRANSLATED] Don't do it till it is too late.

Tue, 21 Apr 2009 07:36:03 +0000

“Green campaigners have finally found out that any contradictions can be transfer except for pollution, because unfortunately, we are all living in the same planet." Currently none of the solutions implemented to relieve the financial crisis are able to completely resolve this problem. We are just tackling the symptoms, not the root. Moreover, we are just thinking of ways to delay the outcome, under the assumption that future generations will have the capabilities of solving these problems. Therefore although the environmental problems that Mr Pan talks about are basically un-transferable, many countries adopt the same logic of delaying the outcome, and trying to transfer the focus of these problems in the short term. However it is apparently unrealistic that we expect later generations to solve problems such as resource shortage and environmental deterioration because this is an irreversible choice. It is unlike financial and other systems, industries and mechanisms which can all be restarted from scratch. When the eco-system spirals out of control, human beings have no where to go. Translated and moderated by Anna Chen.

How can we..

Mon, 03 Nov 2008 07:11:38 +0000

After of 50 years of consuming everything we can, how can we now be in a position to tell the rest of the world: do not consume so much, is not sustainable!

[TRANSLATED] Knowledge is power

Sun, 02 Nov 2008 21:35:56 +0000

Anyone blaming capitalism for how the poor suffer are ignorant of the facts. Capitalism is nothing more than bringing the fruits of your work in an open market to get the best return. The problem here is what is fair, as greed takes hold. Knowing this, anyone else can say, so can greed also take root, in any other economy, including socialism too. The question needs to be more focus upon production and consumption, for that is how the economy works, operates and functions. Just download and watch the FREE video (written by Annie Leonard) for yourself http://web.1.c3.audiovideoweb.com/1c3web3536/StoryOfStuff.mov Source: http://www.storyofstuff.com/dvd.html I'm sure someone can translate the video into the Chinese Mandarin language. It's informative and a straightforward honest truth that needs to be told.

Transferring pollution

Fri, 31 Oct 2008 01:57:42 +0000

There is a little too much conspiracy theory and a lack of understanding as to how things work in the West when it comes to the idea of western governments deliberately transferring polluting industries to countries like China. The US and Europe were in bad shape as recent as the mid 70s due to pollution and the recent passing of many tough environmental laws. Industries had the choice to either stay in their home countries and comply or move. They chose the shortest path to better quarterly profits.

Re: do you know

Tue, 27 May 2008 10:28:32 +0000

Yes, it's here Sam

DO YOU KNOW ?

Sun, 25 May 2008 01:39:12 +0000

is "Saving Beijings Resevoirs" article here?

[TRANSLATED] Self-descipline and self-constraint

Tue, 25 Mar 2008 01:37:06 +0000

I'm pleased to see that so many people comment on the issue of environment protection. However, my question is has everybody acted upon their claims? If one has no awareness of using less of plastic bags, saving water, what good can he or she make by just making comments? How much change can be expected by solely relying on good leadership? Should we wait until everyone else starts to act upon the issue? Let's begin to act right now , to create a better future.

[TRANSLATED] Correction of the comment 52

Wed, 13 Feb 2008 06:21:43 +0000

The article mentioned was written by researchers at the Tyndall Centre at the University of Sussex. Many other studies have been carries on the same issue. Similar conclusions can be found in the World Energy Outlook 2007 of the IEA, and be drawn by WWF's researchers in Norway.